Dr. Erich Jarvis: The Neuroscience of Speech, Language & Music | Huberman Lab Podcast #87

Dr. Erich Jarvis, a professor at Rockefeller University, studies the neurobiology of vocal learning, language, speech disorders, and the relationship between language, music, and movement. His research has discovered a direct link between species with song and movement and the ability to learn complex language. The distinction between speech and language lies in the ability to produce vocalizations and use a system of communication with rules and structure. There is no separate language module in the brain, but rather a speech production pathway and an auditory pathway. Different species have various modes of communication, such as whale songs, dolphin communication, and bird displays. Humans primarily use spoken language, while other species utilize gestures and body language. The brain regions responsible for spoken language are located next to the regions controlling hand gestures, indicating a parallel pathway for communication. The evolution of modern language and the role of vocalization and innate language are discussed, as well as the overlap between brain circuits controlling language and speech in humans and songbirds. The innate predisposition to learn language and cultural hybridization are explored. Genes expressed in speech and language circuits control various aspects of these phenomena. During the critical period of brain development, it is easier to learn new languages or skills. Semantic communication refers to objective or abstract meaning of words, while effective communication involves emotional meaning conveyed through speech. The link between dancing and vocal learning is explored, as well as the relationship between music, dance, emotional bonding, and genetic predispositions. Facial expressions are connected to the circuits controlling language, speech, and hand movements in the brain. The process of going from thought to language to written word involves challenges such as thinking in complete sentences and the connection between language and hand movement. Stutter is a complex condition that can be improved through therapy. The modern evolution of language, specifically in relation to texting, social media, and the future, is discussed. The link between movement and cognitive growth is explored. Comparative genomics and the Earth Biogenome Project are revolutionizing our understanding of animal genomes and their evolution. The evolution of skin and fur color is influenced by the angle of light hitting the Earth and the need for sun protection. The podcast episode also mentions Zero-Cost Support, YouTube Feedback, Spotify & Apple Reviews, Momentous Supplements, AG1 (Athletic Greens), Instagram, Twitter, Neural Network Newsletter, and Huberman Lab Clips.

Dr. Erich Jarvis & Vocal Communication

Dr. Erich Jarvis, a professor at Rockefeller University, studies the neurobiology of vocal learning, language, speech disorders, and the relationship between language, music, and movement. His work spans from genomics to neural circuits and cognition. He discovered a direct link between species with song and movement and the ability to learn complex language. His research is important for understanding speech disorders, language learning, and communication through words.

Speech vs. Language, Is There a Difference?

The distinction between speech and language lies in the ability to produce vocalizations and use a system of communication with rules and structure. While there are behavioral terms that differentiate speech and language, they do not align with brain function. Research and comparisons with animal models suggest that there is no separate language module in the brain. Instead, there is a speech production pathway that controls the production of sound and an auditory pathway that interprets and understands speech. The speech production pathway is specialized to humans, parrots, and songbirds, while the auditory pathway is more common among animals.

Animal Communication, Hand Gestures & Language

The most profound aspect of the topic of animal communication, hand gestures, and language is the parallel pathway for communication between spoken language and hand gestures in humans.

Key points:

Different species of animals have various modes of communication, such as whale songs, dolphin communication, and bird displays.
Humans primarily use spoken language, while other species utilize gestures and body language.
The brain regions responsible for spoken language are located next to the regions controlling hand gestures, indicating a parallel pathway for communication.
Some species are more advanced in either sound production or gesturing.
Brain imaging studies have shown the association between hand movement and language, particularly in Italian culture.
There is an evolutionary connection between the brain pathways that control speech production and gesturing in humans.
Different languages come with a learned set of gestures.
Some animals, like the gorilla Cocoa, can learn gesture communication but cannot produce sounds.
Certain species have motor pathways in the brain for gesturing but lack the additional brain pathway for producing sound, preventing them from gesturing with their voice.

Vocalization & Innate Language, Evolution of Modern Language

The evolution of modern language and the role of vocalization and innate language are discussed in this topic. Key points include:

Primitive emotions and sounds form the early foundation of language.
Basic respiration systems associated with extreme feelings could be the fundamental contrasts of the language system.
Innate vocalizations are found in most vertebrate species, while learned vocal communication is unique to a few species, including humans.
The brain's involvement in handling breathing, grunting, and emotional aspects of behavior is controlled by brain stem circuits and the hypothalamus.
Humans and some other species have the forebrain controlling both innate and learned vocal behaviors.
Genomic data suggests that advanced vocal learning ability existed in our human ancestors and other hominid species.
Neanderthals likely had spoken language, although it may not have been as advanced as in humans.
The ability for spoken language has been present in our ancestors for at least 500,000 to a million years and has evolved culturally and possibly genetically.

Humans & Songbirds, Critical Periods, Genetics, Speech Disorders

The overlap between brain circuits controlling language and speech in humans and songbirds is explored, highlighting the concept of a critical period for language learning. The similarities in brain areas and genes involved in vocal learning between humans and songbirds are discussed, emphasizing the impact of mutations on speech deficits. The video also briefly mentions the unique abilities of hummingbirds in mimicking sounds with their wings.

Innate Predisposition to Learn Language, Cultural Hybridization

The innate predisposition to learn language and cultural hybridization are discussed in the transcript snippets. Key points include:

Young birds, like songbirds, can learn different bird songs, but not as well as their own genetically linked song.
Humans raised in a different culture can learn a different language, but not as well as their native language.
Innate predisposition to learn is similar to the concept of universal grammar in linguistics.
Genetic control and cultural learning both play a role in vocal communication.
Raising a zebra finch with a canary results in a hybrid song.
Social bonding influences the preference for learning from one's own species.

In the phenomenon of cultural evolution and hybridization of language:

Children of different native languages may develop their own language, known as Pidgin.
Pidgin incorporates elements from the various languages spoken by their parents.
Birds with different dialects also exhibit this phenomenon.
When people from separate populations with distinct languages come together, their children merge phonemes and words from both languages.
This results in a hybrid language where the shared phonemes and words become the most commonly used.

Genes for Speech & Language

Genes for Speech & Language:

Genes expressed in speech and language circuits control various aspects of these phenomena
They control the wiring of connections between brain areas and the ability to connect motor patterns in the throat and tongue
Some genes specialize in axon guidance and forming neuronal connections, while others repel connections or provide neuroprotection
Surprisingly, genes involved in neuroprotection are turned on in the speech circuit
Genes for speech and language also control the muscles of the larynx, regulate neuron firing rates, and promote neuroplasticity
Speech production is a complex learning ability that requires precision.

Learning New or Multiple Languages, Critical Periods, Phonemes

During the critical period of brain development, it is easier to learn new languages or skills such as playing the piano or riding a bike. The brain is more receptive to acquiring new knowledge during this time. The speech pathways have a strong critical period, making it easier to learn languages without an accent early in life. The brain has limited capacity for information, so it needs to prioritize what to learn and what to discard. Retaining information is important for survival.

Key points:

Critical period in childhood solidifies circuits for language and speech
Humans have a gene that keeps our speech circuit and brain regions in a more immature state
Learning multiple languages as a child makes it easier to learn languages as an adult
Innate sounds (phonemes) in multiple languages allow for easier learning of additional languages
Hand gestures are associated with sounds and meanings of words
Switching motor movements between languages is not fully understood

Semantic vs. Effective Communication, Emotion, Singing

Semantic communication refers to communication that has meaning, while effective communication refers to communication that has an emotional feeling content. These two forms of communication can be mixed up, such as when singing words that have meaning but also evoke an emotional response due to the sound of the singer. Initially, it was believed that these forms of communication were controlled by different brain circuits, but research suggests that the same circuits used for speech and song are also involved in both semantic and effective communication. This suggests that the brain uses similar circuits in different ways to convey meaning and emotion. Additionally, it is possible for words to be interpreted in different ways depending on the intention behind them, whether it be love or hatred.

Key Points:

Semantic communication refers to objective or abstract meaning of words, while effective communication involves emotional meaning conveyed through speech.
The brain circuits involved in both types of communication are similar, suggesting that the brain uses similar circuits to convey meaning and emotion.
Words can be interpreted differently depending on the intention behind them.
Singing can mix semantic and effective communication by evoking emotional responses through the sound of the singer.
The evolution of spoken language is hypothesized to have initially evolved for emotional mate attraction through singing, and later became used for abstract communication.

Singing, Link Between Dancing & Vocal Learning

The link between dancing and vocal learning is explored in this summary. Dr. Erich Jarvis, who has a background in dance, studied vocal learning in birds as a model for human language. The ability to imitate sounds is found in animals with vocal learning abilities, such as parrots. This discovery in 2009 was a significant moment for the speaker.

Motor Theory of Vocal Learning, Dance

The Motor Theory of Vocal Learning suggests that vocal learning and speech evolved through duplication of motor circuits involved in learning movement. This theory explains the relationship between dance and vocal learning, as animals like Snowball the cockatoo use speech-like circuits when they dance. The theory proposes that the integration of auditory and motor regions in the brain enables coordination of muscle movements with sound, allowing us to speak and dance.

Key points:

Motor Theory of Vocal Learning suggests vocal learning and speech evolved through duplication of motor circuits involved in learning movement
Dance is related to vocal learning as animals like Snowball the cockatoo use speech-like circuits when they dance
Integration of auditory and motor regions in the brain enables coordination of muscle movements with sound, allowing us to speak and dance

Music & Dance, Emotional Bonding, Genetic Predispositions

The relationship between music, dance, emotional bonding, and genetic predispositions is explored in this video. The key points discussed include:

Dance and bodily movement can communicate without words, serving as a distinct form of communication from speech.
Dance in the context of vocal learning species involves synchronizing body movements to rhythmic beats of music.
Humans use their voices for semantic, abstract communication, while learned dance is used for effective emotional bonding communication.
Emotional bonding through dance is more popular than communicating semantic information.
The dance brain circuit inherited the more ancient part of the speech circuit, which was for singing.
Certain forms of music, such as opera, create a literal resonance between the singer and the listener.
There is potential coordination between performer and audience at the level of mind and body.
Resonance between dancers and the audience has been observed at the brain activity level.
One can hear and feel dance even if they cannot physically perform it.
Early exposure and practice may contribute to dancing ability.
Genetic factors may influence motor functions and singing ability.
Genetic predispositions can affect singing skills and may lead to intense arguments during family gatherings.

Facial Expressions & Language, Innate Expressions

Facial expressions are a form of motor pattern that convey emotions and intentions, and they can be conscious or subconscious.

When facial expressions align with speech, it creates a sense of coherence, while mismatched expressions can cue our attention.

The motor circuitry controlling facial expressions is connected to the circuits controlling language, speech, and hand movements in the brain.

Non-human primates also have diverse facial expressions, suggesting that facial expression communication existed in our ancestors.

Humans have added vocalizations to facial expression communication, and the ability to misalign these components is important for maturation.

Facial expressions associated with vocalizations in humans are learned, but there is also an innate component.

Facial expressions help eliminate ambiguity in communication, similar to how facial cues aid in interpreting email messages.

Reading & Writing

The process of going from a thought to language to written word involves challenges such as thinking in complete sentences and the connection between language and hand movement. Reading and writing require the coordination of multiple brain circuits, including visual, speech, auditory, and motor pathways. The neural circuitry involved in this process is explored. Dr. Erich Jarvis explains the relationship between speech, language, and writing, highlighting distinct pathways in the brain for speech perception and writing.

Writing by Hand vs. Typing, Thoughts & Writing

The most profound aspect of the topic is the difference between writing by hand and typing, and how it relates to the process of thought and writing.

Writing by hand requires more arm movement and fine motor control, which may be connected to the simultaneous process of speaking in the brain.
Writing by hand can be faster for a short period of time compared to typing, but writing with fingers takes longer because it needs to align with the speed of speech.
Speech is important as a bridge between thought and writing, and difficulties can arise if one speaks faster than they can type.
Singing or listening to music can help improve movement in individuals with Parkinson's disease because the brain circuits for singing are more ancestral and easier to engage than those for speaking.

Stutter, Neurogenetics, Overcome Stutter, Conversations

Stutter is a complex condition that can cause individuals to hide and speak less due to embarrassment. The current neurobiological understanding of stutter involves the basal ganglia, a brain area involved in coordinating movements. Damage or disruption to the basal ganglia can lead to stuttering. Therapy can help adults repair their stuttering, even if it has persisted since childhood.

Key points:

Stuttering is not linked to slow thinking, as brilliant thinkers can struggle with speech.
Studies on songbirds show that new neurons in the brain can contribute to stuttering, but also aid in recovery.
Behavioral therapy focusing on sensory motor integration and controlling what is heard with what is spoken can help overcome stuttering.
Unconscious joining in the enunciation of the last word of a sentence may be due to the motor theory of speech perception or to synchronize turn-taking in conversation.
Rhythm and turn-taking are important in conversations, and interruption can be contextual and a sign of interest.

Modern Language Evolution: Texting, Social Media & the Future

The modern evolution of language, specifically in relation to texting, social media, and the future, is discussed in this video. Key points include:

Texting and social media allow for rapid communication, although they may lack nuance compared to traditional writing.
Texting engages specific brain regions and circuits, enhancing them with use.
Social media can lead to impulsive and potentially damaging posts due to the short latency between thought and action.
The loss of interpretive abilities and potential for miscommunication are drawbacks of modern language evolution.
Implementing AI-based buffers to regulate and improve communication is suggested.
The potential for translating thoughts into written words through neural signals and computer screens is explored.
The work of Dr. Eddie Chang in translating electrical signals from speech and language areas of the brain is mentioned.
The possibility of wirelessly transmitting speech signals without speaking is discussed, along with ethical implications.
Applying similar techniques to songbirds to understand their singing is also mentioned.
The ability to translate thoughts into written or spoken words is seen as a future possibility.

Movement: The Link to Cognitive Growth

The link between movement and cognitive growth is explored in this video. The speaker shares personal experiences with dance and highlights the positive impact it has on cognitive abilities. Engaging in activities like dancing and reading can improve speaking and understanding skills. The connection between muscle tone and cognitive function is also mentioned. Overall, the video emphasizes the importance of movement in enhancing cognitive abilities.

Key points:

Movement, such as dancing and practicing speech, is linked to cognitive growth
Using the circuits in the brain to control the body requires a lot of brain tissue
Consistent movement and practicing speech can help keep cognitive circuits in tune
Personal experiences support the idea that movement improves performance in various activities.

Comparative Genomics, Earth Biogenome Project, Genome Ark, Conservation

Comparative genomics and the Earth Biogenome Project are revolutionizing our understanding of animal genomes and their evolution. Here are the key points:

Dr. Erich Jarvis is studying animal genomes to identify genetic changes associated with unique traits like vocal learning.
Comparative genomics allows for the study of evolution and origins by comparing genomes of different species.
Dr. Jarvis is involved in large-scale consortiums to produce genomes of vocal learners and their relatives.
The Vertebrate Genomes Project and the Earth BioGenome Project aim to sequence all species on Earth.
Efforts are being made to improve sequencing technology and algorithms to achieve complete and accurate genomes.
The recent achievement of the first error-free human genome and the discovery of missing genetic information in the "dark matter" of the genome are significant milestones.
Comparative genomics and the Earth Biogenome Project provide insights into specialized regulatory regions involved in vocal learning and speech circuit development.
These projects have implications for conservation, including the potential to recreate lost species.
The GenomeArk database stores complete genome assemblies for all species, aiding basic science and potentially resurrecting species.
Funding agencies and conservation organizations collaborate with neuroscientists to obtain high-quality genome data for endangered species.
Understanding brain structures and genomes of different species reveals convergence between humans and songbirds, despite humans feeling more similar to apes.
High-quality genomes are crucial for conservation projects.

Evolution of Skin & Fur Color

The evolution of skin and fur color is influenced by the angle of light hitting the Earth and the need for sun protection. Dark and light skin have evolved independently multiple times in different populations. This evolution is associated with genes involved in melanin formation, which have similar mutations across different species. Similar patterns of evolution can also be observed in the brain, including in the development of language.

Key points:

Skin and fur color evolution is influenced by light angle and sun protection.
Dark and light skin have evolved independently in different populations.
Genes involved in melanin formation have similar mutations across species.
Similar patterns of evolution can be observed in the brain, including language development.

Dr. Erich Jarvis, Zero-Cost Support, YouTube Feedback, Spotify & Apple Reviews, Momentous Supplements, AG1 (Athletic Greens), Instagram, Twitter, Neural Network Newsletter, Huberman Lab Clips

Dr. Erich Jarvis is the focus of the podcast episode, discussing his laboratory's work on human and animal genomics and its implications for language and learning. The podcast encourages viewers to support the channel by subscribing on YouTube, Spotify, and Apple, as well as leaving reviews. It also mentions the sponsors, Momentous supplements and Athletic Greens. The podcast host, Andrew Huberman, invites viewers to engage with the channel on social media and sign up for the Neural Network monthly newsletter, which provides episode summaries and actionable protocols.

Dr. Erich Jarvis discusses the neuroscience of speech, language, and music in a YouTube video titled "The Neuroscience of Speech, Language & Music | Huberman Lab Podcast #87" on the Andrew Huberman channel.
The video mentions Zero-Cost Support, YouTube Feedback, Spotify & Apple Reviews, Momentous Supplements, AG1 (Athletic Greens), Instagram, Twitter, Neural Network Newsletter, and Huberman Lab Clips.
The Huberman Lab Podcast has a clips channel on YouTube covering various topics related to sleep, focus, interviews, caffeine, alcohol, dopamine, serotonin, mental health, and physical health.
The clips are useful for those who have missed earlier episodes or are working through the back catalog of the podcast.
The video concludes with gratitude for the viewers' interest in science.